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Poster: Dudley Dead Date: Jul 16, 2011 8:32am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Post drums/space , what would you like to have heard ?

The Throwing Stones thread, made me think how predictable , and by the numbers that part of the show became as the 80's went on . Geek fantasy time, what would you have shuffled in the place of the usual closers?
My vote goes for either "China>Rider", or a sandwich, with "Rider" at the end .
I also think you might have persuaded Jerry to bring back "Viola Lee", though it is on of those "old songs" that he tended to not want to play, it is a jug-band-blues cover, so it might have a chance ( but we might not like the results ).
So, any "post-drums fantasies "?

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Poster: ice9freak Date: Jul 16, 2011 9:30am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Post drums/space , what would you like to have heard ?

Mason's Children?

as in Drumz > Mason's Children > Visions of Johanna > Viola Lee Blues E: Alligator > Ruben and Cherise.

This post was modified by ice9freak on 2011-07-16 16:30:25

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Poster: Dudley Dead Date: Jul 17, 2011 7:23am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Post drums/space , what would you like to have heard ?

It is funny, most of these suggestions look like Further set lists ! It is sad it took Jerry's death to make these ideas possible . A lot of these songs mentioned are songs with jamming , sadly they moved away from much improvisation post space , as time went on . For me the emotional climax of the show would be the "Jerry ballad", and then it was "game over", Sugar Mag. was always good, but just about anything else seemed like show biz filler . I guess then, for me the real problem, was the closer . I could have mentioned Cosmic Charlie, to end a show . A real lark would have been St. Stephen, either with the ending added on the Aox. album version , or better to just end it on a question , "What would be the answer to the answer man..." Cut .

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Poster: micah6vs8 Date: Jul 16, 2011 1:59pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Post drums/space , what would you like to have heard ?

Was 'Space' just a time to give the drummers a break? I can think of precious few that I listen to.

O.K. fantasy land,

'90's Drums(no space)-> Lesh TOO solo -> TOO -> Viola Lee -> Death Don't -> Caution jam -> Dark Star -> Attics -> Playin' Reprise -> MD

E: (long) NFA -> Walking the Dog

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Poster: bkidwell Date: Jul 16, 2011 2:22pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Post drums/space , what would you like to have heard ?

I wonder if I'm the only one around here who really LOVES space - especially the late era spaces. I think it might be the classical vs. rock & roll dichotomy I talk about a lot. I usually hear space as taking the classical elements in the music to the forefront, and dropping the rock aspect completely.

Even in the very "open" jam era in the early 70s, the improvisation usually stayed in keys and scales that were closely related to the original tune, apart from the sections that engaged in full meltdown. As space developed, it became a part of the show where a much wider harmonic vocabulary was used - Jerry liked to toy with whole tone scales, and there was a very free use of intervals and a lot of exploration of open-ended modulations.

I guess I will try to make this relate to the initial post by saying that post-space, I would like it if the band had stayed more in the "free jam" mode rather than running off a string of tunes without much transition. I think it would have been great if when the drummers came back, the band tried to jam into an original, spontaneous groove, establish that, and only then move the music towards a song.

A wider variety of "closers" would have helped a lot also. Most of the set 2 closer material started to seem very tired and anticlimactic.

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Poster: Dudley Dead Date: Jul 16, 2011 2:39pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Post drums/space , what would you like to have heard ?

I like space also, but, by being more or less a spontaneous improvisation ( with some loose guidelines/ideas) , sometime it is great , sometimes they don't get anything going . I think you are right , that it became better later (sometimes drums>space , was the best part of the show ).
But by happening every night, in the same place every night ,and always following drums ; it did restrict some choices . Drums>Phil>OO would have been fun again.. Or how about the simple reversing of the sections; say Dark Star>space>Mickey joins them on Beam>Bill joins in and the others leave>then work their way from the more exotic percussion to the kits THEN work their way in to OO, The Wheel, etc .

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Poster: bkidwell Date: Jul 16, 2011 3:24pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Post drums/space , what would you like to have heard ?

There are actually an interesting handful of shows where the usual drums/space format got disrupted. It would make a very good subject for a big essay style post, but I doubt anyone has really brought all the research together. One that is notable is 6/16/90 with a big central jam with players coming on and off stage that doesn't map onto traditional drums/space:

http://www.archive.org/details/gd90-06-16.nak.ladner.7763.sbeok.shnf

A lesser known example of shaking it up is an amazing ultralate show at the Philly Spectrum on 10/5/94 where Jerry stayed onstage for all of the drums:

http://www.archive.org/details/gd94-10-05.sbd.unknown.8030.sbeok.shnf

I know there are more interesting examples, but I don't have good enough notes to identify them quickly.

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Poster: reviewr Date: Jul 16, 2011 8:47pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Post drums/space , what would you like to have heard ?

Blues For Allah would be interesting coming out of Drums> Space.

Follow that with a hot Sugar Mag. to end the set.

Encore: Iko.

This post was modified by reviewr on 2011-07-17 03:47:35

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Poster: Purple Gel Date: Jul 16, 2011 6:26pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Post drums/space , what would you like to have heard ?

I always thought Bird Song would be a great post drums tune.

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